#25 Be Great with Dwight Carter

Hey, this is Dave Burgess, and you are listening to The Dave Burgess Show, where we talk education, lifestyle, entrepreneurship, fitness, wellness, principles of success, interview elite performers in their field, and most importantly, cover topics that will empower, inspire, and uplift you. Let's go.

Hey, welcome to The Dave Burgess Show. I am joined by a very special guest, who is Dwight Carter. Dwight is an internationally recognized school leader and speaker. He's been a teacher, coach, assistant principal, principal, currently serving as director of Student Support Systems. He is the co-author of What's in Your Space? Leading Schools in Disruptive Times. He's a contributing author to Because of a Teacher from Impress Books, and we are also proud to publish his book, Be Great, on the Impress line. He is a multiple award winner, including the NASSP Digital Principal of the Year, Academy of Arts and Sciences High School Principal of the Year. He's been the Ohio Alliance of Black School Educators Principal of the Year, and many more. Dwight, welcome to the show.

Appreciate it, Dave. Thanks for having me on, man.

Absolutely. And so, I have your book here, and for those...you can't see this, you're just listening in, but for those who have not seen Dwight's book, Be Great, it's subtitled Five Principles to Improve School Culture from the Inside Out, and it's got kind of a bow tie wrapped into the title of Be Great. And I know if you follow Dwight on social media, you know that the bow tie is kind of a signature look for Dwight. So, Dwight, let's start right there. What's up with the bow tie?

Good question, man. The bow tie started at my daughter's first birthday party. So, my wife asked if I'll wear a bow tie for my daughter's birthday party. We wanted to have like a more of a special theme, you know, more pink and blue and, you know, kind of, you know, celebrating that. So, I said, yeah, I can do that. Never wore one before, other than the clip on back in the day, like at a wedding or, you know, when he was a kid, but I never, like, tied my own tie. So, I researched on YouTube, found this guy. He had, he was a great teacher. It's like a three-minute video on how to tie a bow tie, man, but I could not get it. I mean, for three weeks, I tried, and then like an hour before the birthday party, I was in the bathroom sweating like crazy because it just, it wasn't working, and then, boom, it clicked.

So, that was successful at that time. Then, that was at the time when, like, Bowtie Tuesdays was a big deal on Twitter. So, it was hashtag Bowtie Tuesday. Then, I started wearing one on Tuesdays, and then it sort of, it sort of stuck, and then I started wearing one every single day, and now that's just, that's just what I do. Every day at work, I wear a bow tie, and that's been, so that was like 10 years ago, but I've probably been wearing one every day for probably eight, maybe nine years, and like you said, it's just become a signature look. If I don't have one on, it's abnormal. People say, people say something's wrong with me if I don't have a bow tie on, so it's just a bit. Yeah, you're like, what's going on with Dwight? He doesn't look good. Yeah, what's going on, man? He's thick. You all right?

So, no, it's just been, it's just a part of my look. I like the way it looks. I think it's a lost art, the bow tie is, so it's a throwback to maybe simpler times and I guess being more of a gentleman, so that's what I've been told. Yeah, right on. I love it.

Yeah. And I know that also follows you say on Facebook, knows that you quite often, you have your same quotes out and at the end of the post, always says the same thing, says, make it a great day or not. The choice is yours. And so maybe if you wanted to riff on that and why that's kind of the send off on all your posts.

Yeah, when I was a middle school principal in Gahanna, so I was a middle school East principal, was there for three years and I got this advertisement in the mail from Project Wisdom. So Project Wisdom was a character education program and they, they offered like specific virtue, virtuous lessons around a specific theme and they had like words of wisdom almost every single day. And at the end of it was make it a great day or not, the choice is yours. At the time, I didn't implement it at the middle school because my teachers were really concerned, really concerned about instructional time. I mean, really concerned so much so that announcements, even a 30 second announcement was a disruption. So I decided I'm going to save this until my next principal ship.

So in 2008, I became the Gahanna Lincoln High School principal. And from day one, I started making, I was, I'll give daily words of wisdom first thing in the morning. So much so the seniors, I remember the seniors my first year, they's like, we cannot stand this. But then at graduation, they all cried when I had parting words of wisdom. So I just had these one-liners, it was like 15 or 20 one-liners. After a brief introduction, I ended it with make it a great life or not, the choice is yours. And they just burst out in tears. Parents loved it. Everybody was texting or emailing me about, can they get a copy of this speech?

And so every day for, what, 10 years as a high school principal, I made sure the students heard from me. And it was first thing in the morning, it was the words of wisdom and I ended with that same thing. So to this day, it's 2023, I have students who graduated from 2009 then to 2014 or 2017. Seniors will email me and say, Mr. Carter, I still remember those words. And so they've come to rely on those. And that became an opportunity for me to connect with them and me to connect, for us to connect. And it's sort of, it poured into them when they needed it the most.

So now I'll just continue that on through Facebook and Twitter, just share a daily quote and with that positive message, because it's more, it's affirming, but it's also encouraging and a reminder that we have a choice. We have a choice to decide what our day is going to be like. Yeah, for sure. And I think some of the powerful stuff there is the consistency, right? You were showing up, you were somebody in their life showing up every day with this little positive piece of advice and with this mindset of like, hey, the choice is yours. And eventually that sinks in. And kids are like that, where they will be dismissive of something, make fun of something. But what you realize later is that actually it's seeping in, it's getting through if you're consistent with that message.

And my late friend, John Baret, a great educator that I taught with West Hills High School, unfortunately passed early, what he used to call the daily vitamin. And every day when kids walked into his class, the daily vitamin was on the board and it was a quote and some sort of thing for them to pull in as they're getting all their stuff out. Like they would check in on the daily vitamin and he would talk about the daily vitamin every day before they did their math. And so that consistency is important.

Absolutely. When I was a classroom teacher, I had the quote of the day on the board every morning. It was something I relied on, something I needed as well, but the kids relied on that as well. We would have like a short one minute conversation about what it meant to them. And some people, sometimes we will look up the author of the quote, but oftentimes it was just a quick one minute reflection, I guess, i.e. lesson. And then we move on for the day. So it's that the tone and that establishes that type of culture that you want to have in the classroom and in the school building.

Yeah. And that kind of ties into one of my favorite quotes from your book, that whole, you have a choice.

The quote is this, the only things we have absolute control over our attitudes and actions. And at the start of that chapter where that quote is, you know, Maya Angelou is one of my favorites of all time. And you use her quote, which is, if you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change your attitude, which ties in perfectly too. So this is an important concept for leaders everywhere.

Yeah. Especially today. I mean, things are changing so rapidly and there's so much polarization and, you know, we're at like the extremes of things. And so while we can very easily be swayed by outside circumstances, we can't control it. We can only control those two things, our attitude and our actions. You know, what we do, attitude is our disposition and how we feel about, how we feel about that, that either situation or the day, but we can still respond appropriately and control how we, how we show up. It's hard. I'm not saying it's easy. It's extremely hard. And that's a lifelong journey, but those are two things we can control.

Yeah. And now going to this book, Be Great. I have a section in Teach Like a Pirate where I call it the awkward question. And the awkward question is, do you want to be great? And I talk about, I've been in front of crowd after crowd of educators and ask that question, do you want to be great? And it's usually met with awkward shuffling of feet, avoidance of eye contact. And people don't want to engage with that question because I think that in education, when someone says, I want to be great, it seems almost like egotistical or selfish or something like that. But, and then it's like, Hey, we're in the service profession. Greatness is not about me being better than you. Greatness is about being the best that we can be to serve the people that we're serving.

Right. Right. And that's the thing. Like you said, we're in a service industry. We serve others and the higher we go up in an organization, the more people we are choosing to serve. And the most important people we serve are the two groups, our teachers and our students. And so, you know, while I use the word being great, it's an acronym for five principles that sort of, I guess, lay a pathway to what greatness could be.

And if you think about the G, you know, is be grateful. That's just being reflective of the blessings that you have around you that you've been given and the opportunities that you have, tangible and intangible. And so if we, if we show gratitude for even the troubles that we have, because those are learning opportunities that truly will impact the culture that we want to create. If we're constantly complaining about the things that are happening around us, or we come with a negative attitude every single day, that too is contagious. You know, people will, you know, you give people permission to be that way because you're that way. And so we're flipping that on its head. If you're if you're showing gratitude and looking at the opportunities to grow and to learn and to serve deeper, then that will have a huge impact on the culture.

And then, you know, the relationships, you know, the more gratitude you show, the deeper relationships you have with other people. Those relationships come from, you know, being enthusiastic, not in terms of your emotion, but being enthusiastic. Going back to its original version of the word, which is purpose, you know, you remember your why. And that's been a huge thing in 2023, 2022, 2023. Everybody's like, remember your why. But I'm a still Principal Kefele is like, remember why you stayed. Like we know why you we know why you're in education, but why did you choose to stay in education?

Yeah. So like rejuvenate, return to that purpose, then you can be your authentic self, which is the A. And then ultimately, the T is being teachable.

And that's just are you willing to learn again as times are changing so rapidly and they're going to continue to do to be that way? Are we willing to learn new ways of doing things? I heard I think it was Clay Cook. No, it was Dr. Adolph Brown. I was in a panorama summit last week. It was a webinar. He said something that was so profound and it was like, beep. And it reminded me of being teachable. He says, if we don't reflect on our practices, they will soon become malpractice. And I was like, wow, wow. Yeah. And that's awesome.

Yeah. If we if we rely on the practices that we've known all the all along, but we don't reflect on how those practices are effective or ineffective right now, then they very easily can become become malpractice and malpractice is like you're hurting the people that you're trying to serve because you're holding on to what you've always done because you've always done it that way before. We've always done it that way. Yeah. Which is a dangerous sentiment. Right. Absolutely. When you start to hear yourself saying that, then you know you're in trouble. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

I think the other piece about this is. Now, you wrote a book called Be Great. Yeah. And but at the same time, it's not a book where you're saying like, oh, hey, by the way, I'm great. Far from it. Look, it's a it's a pursuit, right? It's something that you're aspiring to. And this is the way you put it in the book. You said being great is not about being perfect. It's about being consistent, persistent and resilient. And you're super open, sharing very, very great vulnerability. Some of your struggles along the way, moments maybe where you were not great, but you learned some lesson out of that.

Yeah, I was definitely not a here look at me as the model. It's like, no, I can relate to what he's saying because I'm there now or I've been there before or I feel like I'm walking through that now or I'm walking through that now. So by no means is this a mirror to say or a banner of me standing up on the podiums like I'm the guy that follows like now, you're on this journey with the rest of us. Yeah, I'm in a journey with everyone else. And it truly is a journey. And I like you said, I share some pretty significant mistakes that I've made along the way. But those are opportunities to grow and to learn and to reflect upon, to say, you know, what I did may have had a negative impact on the culture and the climate at the time. But here's how we are moving, moving through that and into a different space.

So one of the stories that I talk about, I began the book with a story of myself in a scooter. I was going to say, is this going to be the scooter incident? Like that was so out of character. But I shared it because there's a lot of lessons in that. The first lesson was I didn't control my attitude or my actions. I let the moment control how I responded, how I reacted. Number two is it showed that it showed that I forgot the relationships that I had with students and to to really look at them as as growing people and not adults because they made a simple they made a simple mistake. And number three, I let my emotions and how I felt about the adults in that in that situation. I let that control how I then treated students and how I reacted afterwards. And it also hurt our relationship to like I said, I shared how my secretary responded and that changed the dynamic of our relationship as well. But again, I made amends. I talked to the parents, I just talked to my superintendent. But I still I still think about that because that left a mark.

And Joe Sanfilippo says it best. We don't get to choose what people remember. And so if they remember that in that whole situation, that can define my relationship with them when there was so much more to it, but that's what they remember. So the relationships got mended and the drywall got fixed. Yeah. The drywall got fixed, fresh paint is like it never even happened. I love it.

Well, you should you should another one from and for those that don't know, you're a twin. Yes. And so you had several stories about growing up with your twin brother. Yeah. Including the baseball story about making the all-star team and not making the all-star team. And I and you learn a life lesson from your mom, too, about how you reacted in that moment in that situation. And, you know, the fact that you don't you don't get stuff in life by just showing up. Yeah. Like you also have to perform.

Yeah. And I use that story to talk about the difference between participating and performing and how I define that is when we think about performing, it's not putting on the show, it's just showing up as your very best at that moment and trying to be consistent with that and participating is just showing up like you're there. And, you know, sometimes we think participating is just enough. Just being there is enough. And that's a part of it. But what are you what are you doing because you're there? What are you doing with the space that you have? What are you doing with the platform that you have? What do you what do you do with the opportunity that you have? What do you what are you doing with the the people that you've been entrusted with? Are you just showing up? Are you participating? Are you performing at your very best? And that doesn't mean you're performing perfectly. It just means you're performing at your very best, as consistent as you can at that moment.

So the story is, you know, I have a twin brother, I'm four minutes older than him. He's much more athletic. And growing up, we were neck and neck, but he was still, he was, he was, he was, he was good. He was, he was the man. I'll put it that way. Because of our personalities, I was always in the shadow of him. And so that's what people would always call me. He's like, Dwight is the shy twin, Dwayne is the outgoing twin. It's like self-fulfilled prophecy, you start to become what people call you. And so I started to be real shy and pull away, and, and I didn't necessarily have my voice, but I showed up athletically. So showing up athletically, I'm thinking I'm doing my best. You know, we have a great season. We have three all-star selections. Like I said, my brother and I, we did everything together, dressed alike, we rode our bikes, we did everything together. And so when he got selected to the all-star game, I just knew, you know, Dwight and Dwayne, you know, two peas in a pod. He's in, I'm in. So he got selected, called his name, and then the second guy was the coach's little brother. That was a little suspect, but hey, you know, things, things happen. Little nepotism there. Yeah, a little bit, but hey, I mean, I get it. And then the third person was Dwight Young. When he said Dwight, I'm thinking, I'm in. When he said Young, it just crushed me.

So Dwight Young was our first baseman and he was phenomenal. And my mom, like, you know, I threw an eight-year-old fit and my mom was there that day. And I thought she's going to come to my rescue because you don't mess, mom was mama bear. You don't mess with her cubs. But I embarrassed her, how I acted, you know, how I threw my glove down, started crying. And then she, she taught me a very valuable lesson. She picked me up by my shirt collar. Like, don't you ever act like that again. If you want something, you better earn it. And again, 40, 51 years, I'm 51 years old now. I remember that lesson like it was yesterday. You have to work hard to get the things that you want. Nothing is ever guaranteed. Ever guaranteed. Yeah.

I like you mentioned that performance, maximum effort in an inspired manner that evokes emotion and produces positive results. Like that producing those positive results, that's, that's key right there. Yeah. Yeah. Because everything we do produces a result. Is it positive or is it negative? Yeah. Yeah. So I just want to focus on that positive because we need so much of that these days. Yeah. All right.

So now I'm kind of blown away because you just said something. You said that your twin was the more athletic one.

Yeah. Your twin must be a beast because I did a little research about your athletic career. Yeah.

And so for those of you who don't know, maybe Dwight was a little athletic as well. And so went to Wittenberg, is that right?

Yes. Wittenberg University. All right. That's in the NCAC, North Coast Athletic Conference.

And so this is what my research tells me that Dwight won seven NCAC titles, indoor and outdoor, in track and field, 13 all NCAC awards. And he held the 110 meter hurdles record for a decade. And then the 400 meter hurdles record, I think it was maybe like topped in 2013 or something like that, but he held it for a long time.

And so you were a track and field superstar.

I was pretty good. Yeah. I had great coaching, great teammates, but yeah, I had a great track career in college.

More than I, I mean, it was better than I ever imagined it was going to be, but I had a great coach. I had great coaching. That was just, I don't know, our coaches were very in tune to, they knew us as individuals. They knew how to get the most out of us and they believed in us. And so when you doubt yourself, but you know, somebody believes, somebody else believes in you, you don't have a choice, but to believe in yourself.

So, and you know, just the methods that were used, the positive affirmation, but also the correction when necessary, focus on goals.

So one of the things my head coach taught me was to get an index card and write down your goal time for the year. And I remember this, my junior year, I had the goal time hanging up on my mirror and also hanging up in my locker.

After the first meet of the season, I had to write another goal because I said I broke that my goal time, the first meet of the season, which was unbelievable.

And so I had to set my bar a little bit higher because I had already accomplished the goal that I set out to do. So I'd be like, okay, I have to perform even higher.

But again, the support, the coaching, the encouragement was there to do that and the training.

And so to this day, I still, and I teach this to my nieces, my niece and my nephew who are both athletes, you know, get that time, put it down, write it somewhere.

Now it's like put it in your phone so you can probably make it a screen service. You see it every day.

And my niece just broke her goal time a couple of weeks ago. And my nephew did the same thing when he was in high school, running track.

So it's something I learned from them and I was able to pass it on to my family.

But again, all those records, all those championships and all conference awards came from just hard work and phenomenal coaching.

Yeah. I think of that and that speaks to the power of mentorship. That coaching that you received, which then you turned around and I'm sure as a coach, you coached, it was track and field and football, is that right?

Yeah. And that's how I coached. I had a phenomenal wide receivers coach in college named Coach Barter. Coach Barter saved my football career. He really did.

Was it my sophomore year? Yeah, my sophomore year. He was a running back coach before and then he switched over to receivers because he saw that we had a lot of talent, but we didn't have the yardage that we should have.

And we had two guys that ran 4-4 on the ends. We had a third guy who was like just, he ran routes like, I mean, he was just amazing. Precision.

Precision. Very precise routes.

So as a team, wide receiver team, we had all the talent in the world, but we just needed additional support and coaching.

So he took over and taught us how to run after the catch. He taught us how to be much more precise in our routes. But his premise was, if you don't block, you're not seeing the field.

So I was a beast on the receiving end because I would put a DB on his butt quickly. I'm going back. I'm hitting linebackers.

"I'm cracking down on free safeties, corners, you know, I'm putting them down because I played angry because we didn't throw the ball as much. But I found what can be my role on this team to give us the best opportunity to win the conference championship. And again, the coach was, he was very supportive, very encouraging, very encouraging, always gave positive feedback, but he sandwiched that with constructive criticism on how to get better. He wasn't a yeller and a screamer, which I don't, that doesn't, that doesn't work with me. It's more, you know, again, he knew me, put his arm around my shoulder, would talk and say, hey, next time do this. You did that great, but try it this way next time. And then he would constantly encourage as you're doing it."

"So that's how, that's how I led as a classroom teacher, as an athletic coach, and as a principal. Didn't do a lot of yelling and screaming and things like that, but I tried to give positive feedback and identify how to connect with each person. I wasn't successful with everybody, but I did have some level of success. So the coaches and the mentors that I had taught me how to be the educator that I ended up becoming. Yeah. I think there's so many powerful leaders who have a background in coaching and the kind of lessons that you learn as a coach, teachers too, like the teaching, coaching, leadership, it's so intertwined and you know, what brings excellence in one area, it just carries over into the other area too."

"And I had the benefit of playing for lots of great coaches as well, coaching myself. I had the benefit to work for John Wooden for three years at his basketball camps and all that. And just to be around that kind of high level of mentorship was life-changing. Yeah. You work with the master, man. That's awesome. Yeah. He was the man."

"All right. So in, in be great, you talked about the acronym, the TV and teachable. One of the things that really stood out to me as I was going through the book, Dwight, the sheer number of other books that you reference, Ted Talks, videos you saw. You are a voracious consumer of information learning, and that's a big part of who you are and that comes across in the book. So I think, I think that's a pretty significant part of it."

"Yeah. I opened up the chapter with the quote from my current superintendent, Dr. Kim Peach Miller. She says, I live my life in a state of continuous improvement. And I started, I opened the chapter with that book because that exemplifies, I think, how I live my life, which I'm, I'm curious and being teachable is you're, you're, you have a curiosity about other things. And as things are changing so rapidly. We have to stay curious. We have to stay adaptable and flexible and constantly consume information so that we can keep moving in the right direction and, and bringing other people along. So I listened to podcasts quite a bit. I have a huge library of podcasts. I used to consume audio books, but now I'm returning just to reading hard copy, hard, you know, paper, paperback books because I just, it's something about the feel of a book. You just, you need that."

"Like I said, TED talks, I try to find topics that are relatable to something or relevant to what I'm going through at the time. Yeah, just, and then social media expanded my opportunity to connect with other people. So I'll say one of the biggest impacts on my career was joining Twitter and I used to hate social media. I mean, despised it. I thought it was the dumbest thing ever. Didn't care what the stars ate, who they were dating, because that's how I saw it. So I went to a, went to a social media bootcamp sponsored by Mindset Digital, blew me away."

And so they, because we were educators, they focused on, they found educators who were on, on Twitter at the time and three people they exposed me to, I think it was four, George Kouros, which has been probably the most significant impact on my growth as a leader. Eric Scheniger, he was the original digital principal. Patrick Larkin, he was another original digital, digital principal and Jimmy Casas. So I started following those guys and I knew more about their schools than I knew about the neighboring district school because they were, they were phenomenal at sharing their story.

And then I found Joe Sanfilippo and then Derek McCoy and then we just started interacting with those guys. You can say we were early adopters. They were early. They were the earliest adopters. And I just followed what they were doing. And then I reached out to George through social, through Twitter, social media, or direct message. I think it was like 10 o'clock at night. I said, man, I have a question for you. He's like, great. Give me a call. So 10 minutes, 20 minutes went by and he just messaged me again. It's like, I thought you were calling. I'm like, you mean tonight? He's like, yeah, yeah. So I called him up. We talked for about a half an hour and we've been friends ever since.

And so his, his willingness to talk to a complete stranger about what he was doing and answer my question and then be sincere about it was like, hey, save my number. Call me anytime. And then Eric Shinnick was the same way and then Patrick Larkin and Jimmy, all those guys that I talked about, they were so, they modeled what it meant to be teachable because they were putting themselves out there and sharing information and blogging. And then, then I quickly started blogging soon after I started blogging and just reflecting on my role as an educator and as a leader.

And then that sort of expanded more opportunities to grow and learn from other people. And so I constantly stayed curious about being a better educator for other people and then understanding what's going on in our times and how to really support teachers. There are the changes that we're facing, but also to understand our students' worlds. And you know, that's how I just started talking to other people who are already doing it.

Yeah, for sure. No, it was a life changing thing for me as well. Those are all fairly early connections for me and social media as well. Just had a Zoom with Derek McCoy down in North Carolina just last week. And so it's good to reconnect with him.

And then I stumbled upon this tall guy, raspy voice with a pirate's bandana on his head. Oh man, that's scary. I was like, who is this dude? Who's this guy walking around education conferences dressed like a pirate? Dressed like a pirate, man, and then teach like a pirate, just took off. And I remember the first time I saw you in person was at Pickerington, I think it was at Pickerington Central High, Pickerington North High School. That was probably seven, eight years ago. That was a long time ago, yeah. You were the keynote presenter there and blew us out of the water. I was there, I was doing a session there. I was like, man, this dude is crazy, like not crazy bad, but you were just all over the place.

Lots of words. Lots of words. Very fast. Yeah, you blew our minds, man. So I was very, very inspired by that message. Thank you. I always tell people, I say, what do you think about when you go out there? I'm like, listen, here's what I'm thinking, I'm thinking I'm gonna burn this place down around these people. God help the person who picks up this microphone next, because I'm gonna burn this place down. Yeah. That's the goal. And that is what you did.

So yeah, it's been, I mean, I've loved watching your growth, and I don't mean this because we're on this podcast now, but seriously, man, you've modeled how to evolve and stay relevant.

Because you had Teach Like a Pirate, and then it was Lead Like a Pirate, and then then DBC and corporate. And then you started like, you started publishing books and publishing other people's, you know, getting other authors to write and then you have your whole Lead Like a Pirate, like series and then you and different authors like Balance Like a Pirate with Jessica Johnson and Sarah or Jessica, Jessica Johnson and Sarah. Yeah, man, it's just, it's been great to meet them at the NASSP conference. So it's been great to just, number one, now be a part of the DBC Inc. family through Impress, but also just to be able to connect with the people that I've learned about through the work you've done.

Yeah, it was something early on as a recognition that like, I don't do not have all the answers. And so after I told my story, it was like, okay, like, people would always say, are you going to write Teach Like a Pirate part two, I'm like, I did my thing, I told my story. So now, but my story is not the only story. So now let's spend some time trying to amplify other people and find people with great messages like yourself and try to spread those messages as well. So yeah, I think that takes a new journey.

Yeah, and that takes a great sense of humility to know that, you know, I have this platform now and how do I help other people share their story and help other people. So I, if you haven't heard it, man, I heard it from anybody lately. I appreciate what you've done for others. Thank you. Thank you. It's absolutely, I absolutely love it. So I get to work with so many amazing people. So it's amazing.

Yes, sir. Hey, so I will switch gears for you. Okay. So you're from Ohio.

Yes. So first of all, I have a positive connection with Ohio recently, in that I just ran my first half marathon and it was the Columbus half marathon, which is a super cool, yeah, super cool half marathon. Did that in October. But I have another connection with Columbus as a music lover, with Ohio as a music lover, I should say. And that is, I don't know if people realize it, but Ohio, you think of like music, you think of New York and different places, like Ohio is like the hotbed of funk music. And so obviously you have like the Ohio players and Lakeside and Roger and Zap, like Roger Troutman and all those things. And that was like a big part of my growing up is listening to Zap and Roger on his talk box and all that kind of stuff like that. And so do you have any connection to that Ohio music scene? Like, did you, do you see these people as you were growing up?

No, I didn't see them growing up. I heard them all the time because my mom, you know, she just, she played the music all the time when Roger Troutman and Zap came out. That was like, but that's, those are skating rink days. So we would all go to the skate rink and, you know. More bounce than the ounce would come off. Yeah, man. Yeah. Proving around the rink, doing that. Ohio players was always playing when we were younger because that was like, my mom was and my aunts and uncles, that was, that was their, that was the jam. But yeah, so we, I grew up on, like you said, classic R&B, classic hip hop. And then it transitioned to more like pop and R&B, you know, with New Edition and Michael Jackson and, you know, all those guys going through high school or middle school and high school.

So yeah. Ohio also Bone Thugs-N-Harmony. Yeah, Bone Thugs from Cleveland. Bow Wow, he was from like Reynoldsburg, Ohio. I saw Roger and Zap at a place, it was a nightclub in San Diego. It's not there anymore, but it was called Smokey's. And Smokey Gaines was the basketball coach for the San Diego State Aztecs. And little side story on Smokey is, first of all, he was the first black division one basketball coach in California, but his most famous player was a baseball player, Tony Gwynn. And so Tony Gwynn was his point guard for several years.

And people always think of Tony Gwynn as one of the greatest hitters of all time, obviously. But he was also an incredible basketball player. And I don't know if it's been broken, but for a long time, he was still the assist leader at San Diego State in basketball. Wow, I didn't know that.

Yeah, multiple sport athlete. But Smokey's had a nightclub too, called Smokey's, and it was kind of a small little place to see somebody as big as Roger and his brothers. And I just remember going in there, and probably the only white guy in the venue on that night. And the band came out and was playing, no sign of Roger, right? It's just jamming, and people are just getting into it, but everyone's like, where the heck is Roger? And then all of a sudden, the lights went down, and you just heard his talk box. And it's just like, are you ready, San Diego, like on his little talk box thing. And the crowd just fell out, it's like, oh my God, boom, the lights pop on, and there's Roger with his little talk box, and doing like, so rough, so tough, or something like that. It was like, whoo. That's showmanship.

That's how you perform.

Yeah, exactly.

Yep, it makes all the difference in the world. So here he was at this plant, man. That was like a peak. People talk about peak experiences and peak thing, like, I am 56 years old, but I can remember being in that little nightclub down in Mission Valley, down by the stadium, Smokies, and like the lights popping off, and then like that talk box going. And, whew, man, that was a moment.

Let me ask you this, Dave. Did those memories and experiences, did that impact how you present? Did that impact how you perform?

Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah, absolutely.

How you taught and how you present? A thousand percent, yeah. It's the impact, that's where the, you know, I talk about the triple Venn diagram, you have your content, right? And you have all these techniques, those are two of the circles, but there's this third circle, and that third circle is presentation. Right? And so, it's like, okay, yeah, you might be good on your instrument, and you might have good technical skills, but like it's also the performance is the presentation.

Yeah.

You think about someone like, say, Prince, same way, one of the greatest musicians of all time, but like, man, it's about the show. Yeah. Yeah. And that's connecting to the emotion. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Where you get that feeling, like that tingle down your, like that thing that goes up your spine and that little goosebumps on your skin, like, oh my God, I can't believe I'm here for this moment.

You know, that's the kind of thing, if we can create that in school for kids, that's a powerful thing. It is.

So, this book, another thing in the opening of it, this might be labeled the book that almost didn't happen.

Yeah, man. Because you were working on this thing for a hot minute. And so, you talk a little bit about imposter syndrome, and whether people will admit it or not is something that we all struggle with. And I work with a lot of authors, and there have not been too many that didn't hit a block at some point were saying, like, who am I to put this book out? I don't know if I should do this anymore. And so, how was it for you kind of overcoming that sense of like, should I really be putting this book out?

Well, it was, I think it was twofold. And the pandemic was the spark, because I had no more excuses, I had nothing but time. And my wife has been on me for years, even before I co-wrote What's in Your Space and Leading Schools in Disrupted Times, she was like, how come you haven't done your own book yet? How come you haven't done Be Great? You have it written, just write it. And so, the more she said it, the more frustrated I was getting, because I knew she was right.

But I just, I just felt like it wasn't worthy enough to be, to be on pen to paper and produced as a solo book. I was much more comfortable being a co-author than a solo art or solo author. And then when the pandemic hit, and George's, you know, every, every chance, every nearly every chance George and I talked, he would say, so where's the book? You ready? And I was like, I'll come up with some excuse. I'll say yes. And then three weeks later, haven't touched it.

And then during the pandemic, and then Paige started getting on me, Paige Kuros' wife's like, hey, Dwight, you know, what's going on? They tag teamed it. Yeah, it's like, you got a great concept. Let's, let's, let's get that book going. I was like, all right, yeah, we can go ahead and get started. And then nothing. And then I want to say maybe it's April, April, April of 2020, maybe May, I sent George and Paige a text like, I'm ready. And it's like back. So we met up, we talked about the detail and it got real serious then. I mean, playtime was over, it got real serious. Like they put their, they like took their hat, turned it around backwards and was like, okay, it's go time.

And so they became very serious about the work, you know, talk contract and put everything in place. And, and then I just sat and I still just looked at the contract, like, what the hell did I just do? And then, you know, my wife gave me a pep talk, George gave me a pep talk. So, you know, get to get, get some concepts together and put it, put it out there. And then I would stop and question and doubt. And then that process kept going and going, then just, you know, one more conversation with George. He's like, look, man, you committed to the, let's get it going, like, let's go.

And so I just leaned into it, gave myself a day, I set a goal, like I want it done by this date. And so once I, once I returned to an old practice that I shared earlier, like writing a goal date or a goal time and posting that somewhere, now I had, I made a promise to myself, not just to somebody else, but to other, to myself, made that promise to myself. So I really had to break through the imposter syndrome that still, I still struggle with. I mean, we all do. Yeah, yeah. And so I got it done.

And even, even when I got it done, I was still unsure about how good it was and what would it be, what people want to buy it or buy it when people want to read it. And then I didn't want to, then I didn't want to disappoint, you know, you and George and Paige, because you guys are invested in this as well. And so it was, it's still, it's still a surprise, even again, the book is written, you see it on the shelf behind me. People have purchased the book, people have commented on the book, people have given me given ratings on the book, but I still struggle with how meaningful it is.

And so I don't know if I'll ever get through that. But the fact that I did it, and I, and I had people in my corner, like George and Paige and my wife, Samantha, my daughter, Gabrielle, my family, like my mom and brother, my sister, they were like, just so proud, you know, my extended family, just so proud. And so seeing their pride reminds me that, you know, I accomplished the goal. But it still doesn't, it still doesn't replace the feeling that I have about that imposter syndrome. So it's still something I'm working through.

Yeah, it's a surreal thing to hold your own book in your hand. Yeah. And it's something that like, it's, that doesn't fade very quickly. Right. Right. I still think if I walk in a store, I see my book, I'm still flipping out. Yeah. All these years later, like, oh my God, like, are you kidding me? Like this? Yeah. Yeah. I was at the National Education, National Conference on Education sponsored by AASA this past week. So I just like, let me just visit the bookstore, wasn't anticipating seeing my book there at all. I'm just walking around.

And I see, you know, Joe Sanfilippo, I see Steve Bollard, Berute Caffelli, Rudy Caffelli, Dave Burgess, George Coros, Jimmy Casas, I'm seeing, you know, all you all's books. And I turn around and there's a center table. And as soon as I turn around, boom, there was, there was Be Great. And I was just like, what? That's amazing. Yeah. That's such a feeling. So I took a picture of it and sent it to my wife and then sent it to George as well as like, Jordan Page. And he was like, man, I can't believe this book is here. And there's only a few copies left. So people, people purchased it. So yeah, I was very, that was very humbling.

Rudy Caffelli, the greatest voice in education. Man, that's my dude, man. That guy. I'll go anywhere to hear that voice. Yeah. His questioning, man. I mean, he will hit you with a right hook. And then the body blow with his questions. And then pick you up. It's like, you got this.

Exactly. And I mean, he's a contributor to Be Great. And so when I reached out to him and he said yes, man, I darn near shed a tear because that was, I went out on a limb. I truly did because he's such a huge voice in education, just in leadership in general. So for him to believe in me and believe in the book so much that he contributed to it was a huge shock, but a major blessing. So I'm forever indebted to him. And then like I said, there's, I think, 11 other people who contributed. So I reached out to people all over the country and all walks of life. So you know. There's some great names in there.

Yeah. George wrote the foreword. And then my best friend, Steve Bowler and Kim Miller, my superintendent, they contributed to the Be Teachable chapter. Principal L? Principal L's in there? Yeah, that's my dude, man. Yeah. The very first guest on the Dave Burgess Show, Principal L.

Yeah. So I reached out to him. He was more than happy to contribute. Good friend of mine here in Columbus named Diane Campbell. She's a principal coach. She shared Sarah Johnston. She talked about, I think, purpose. I met Megan Anderson. She's a local educator here locally here in Ohio. I met her through, we were working together through a company called Dynamics. She shared her story and just in such a beautiful way. Kim Strobel, I met her through Steve Bowler. She contributed to just, she does a lot of research on happiness and gratitude and how that's so impactful in leadership and learning. Sarah Rothstein, I met her from George. She talked about her relationships and how she, like through research, how she really digs deep to build relationships with kids.

So all these, my, probably my leadership coach, Jax Levinsky, I mean, he provides, he's been such a huge help to me over the last, I'll say seven years. So I was glad to have him a part of it. Tom Cote, again, it's just people from all walks of life, all stages of life as well. So it's been, and again, I appreciate their willingness to contribute because they believe in the message as well.

Yeah. You know, you mentioned Levinsky. I actually pulled a quote from him because I enjoyed it so much and he was working with your leadership team and y'all were struggling through some stuff and kind of blaming some stuff that had happened in the past and like this quote, like this, this will slap you in the face. He said, how long, and then he said like, when did that happen? That thing that you guys all are complaining about, like when was that? And then you said it was like two years ago or whatever. And then he just shot back. How long are you going to drag that anchor?

Yeah. Woo. That is, that's top notch right there.

You ask the reflective question in the book, what anchors are you dragging around? And that's a good, that's a powerful reflective question for people to think about.

Yeah. So that was a, that was a pivotal moment for us as a team, because again, what he was telling us is you're blaming everybody else, but you control your attitudes and actions.

So let's buck up, let's get it done. Yeah. Yeah. And I think another thing you talked about that you, you reframe this whole, or I have people that you work with reframe to this, this language, how, how powerful language is when you say like, I have to do this, I need to do this and changing that to, I get to and I want to, and that's something, you know, I think that's powerful. Not just in leadership, but they can personal things, but the fit and the fitness journey as well. Like people say, I have to go on a run today. I catch myself saying stuff like that sometimes to like, no, no, no, like I've been injured and haven't been able to run on many days and it's horrible and all I want to do is go on a run. So when I can go on a run, I should not be saying I have to go on a run. I get to go on a run today. So it, but it changes everything.

Yes, sir. It's a matter of, again, it goes back to attitude and actions like changing it. There's some things we have to do obviously, but truly we don't have to do them like we get to. Yeah. And once you look at what you get to do, cause it's, you're showing some gratitude, you're grateful for those opportunities or those challenges that changes your perspective and your point of view and then, you know, changes how you feel about it as well.

Yeah. Speaking of the fitness, the fitness grind, I know that you are, it gets tougher and tougher the older we get and you're not as old as me, but you know, you might have a couple of years on you. I see some gray in your beard. I don't know. I'm a, I'm a, I'm silver now. It's all silver.

So but you do have a kind of a unique challenge that I saw you put out on Facebook at the beginning of the year and it has to do with pushups. So break down what this pushup thing is.

So it was two years ago, yeah, maybe two years ago, I saw, I think I saw it on Twitter or Instagram or something. I was like, it was a 10,000 pushup challenge, but they broke it down into like, if you do 20, I think it was like 28 pushups a day, then you can get up to one, get to 10,000. I thought, man, that's doable. It's only 28. I mean, that's not, that's not bad at all. So that's what I started doing. I did the first seven days and then 14 days, and it just, then it became like, it wasn't a matter of if I was going to do them, it was when I was going to get them done. And so I knocked those out of the park and I said, if I can do 28, then I can do 30. Then it turns out if I can do 30, I can do 35, and if I can do 35, I can do 50. So as I was getting stronger, I just started doing more and more pushups. And I think the first year, I think I got to like 17,000 plus. And then last year, or yeah, last year, I had a setback. August 9th, I had back surgery because I've had, you know, herniated discs, two discs. Actually one was like 16 years old and the other one was probably three or four years old. But it got to the point where I just couldn't, I couldn't function through the pain anymore. So I finally, after like shots and physical therapy and chiropractor and all that stuff, nothing was working. So I just finally opted to get the surgery. And so I had to, I cut, I had to stop doing everything. I did that up to the day of the surgery.

And then that, but that stopped my streak. I had a workout streak. I had a pushup streak going on and it was hard to stop because it became such a part of my routine. But three weeks after I was cleared, I started doing my pushups right away and I still got to 20,000 for the year. Even taking, taking time off, I still, you know, had 20,000. I didn't have a goal number. Like I want to hit this number at the end of the year. I just want to, I just want to be consistent and do pushups every single day. And so now I've committed to a hundred a day. And again, but again, break the hundred down to, you can do 25 at a time. You can do 50 at a time. You don't have to do 100 at the, a hundred at a time, just do what you can.

And so, and the reason why I do that is because it's a promise I made to myself. If I can, if I can commit and fulfill the promise I made to myself, then I should be able to make, commit to promises that I make for other people. And so it's just a form of discipline and being consistent. Yeah. I love it. That's awesome. Yeah.

Well, so Dwight, if people want to connect with you, people want to ask you questions, people want to bring you in to speak, work with you in any way, what are some of the best places to reach you?

You can reach me on Twitter at Dwight underscore Carter. You can email me at MrDwightCarter at gmail.com. You can also find me on Instagram at Dwight Carter or LinkedIn at Dwight L. Carter.

Awesome. And if you have not picked up Be Great Yet, make sure you go out and grab that book. It's amazing. It's inspirational, has all sorts of wisdom in there, not just from Dwight, but he pulls in such a wide array of not just guest writers, but also just the kind of resources he's talking about. You look in the back, the book is just packed with references to the books that he's referenced inside of Be Great. You're going to love it.

And Dwight, we're super proud of the project and proud to work with you and love the work that you're putting out into the world and the kind of impact you're making. And I really appreciate you coming on the show.

Yes, sir. I appreciate you and thank you and Impress for believing enough in me to publish my words, man. Appreciate it.

You bet. Our honor.

All right, buddy. Thank you so much for listening to The Dave Burgess Show. Let's connect. I am at Burgess Dave on Twitter. My name just flipped around to Burgess Dave. On Instagram, I am DBC underscore INC and I blog at DaveBurgess.com. Please share your thoughts and comments on social media using the hashtag Dave Burgess Show. It would mean the world to me if you share the show with friends and colleagues and I would be honored if you left a positive review on whatever platform you listen on. Hit that subscribe button so you never miss an episode and if you have a question, a topic or a guest recommendation for the show, just email me at Dave at DaveBurgess.com, put podcast question in the subject line and I absolutely cannot wait to join you on the next episode.